Dawkins and Hitchins planning to arrest the Pope!

[jaywhat]

Latest post of the previous page:

The lastest email from the National Secular Society on the papal visit is here -.

Earlier this year you were one of over 28,000 people who signed our Make the Pope Pay petition. Together, we called on the Prime Minister to ask the Catholic Church to pay for the Pope's visit to the UK and to relieve the taxpayer of the cost, which we estimated to be £20 million.

Your fantastic response to our petition indicates the large reservoir of resentment in this country at the prospect of spending millions of pounds on a 'state visit' that will be predominantly religious in character.

However, as you've probably heard, the Pope is still coming – and we're all still paying for it.

The cost to the taxpayer of this state visit appears to be spiralling out of control – estimated to now be in the region of £100 million, when all security costs are taken into consideration.

If you believe, as we do, that the Pope should not come to the UK without hearing from the millions of people who oppose the interference of the Vatican State in British politics please visit the Protest the Pope website and sign up for email alerts. http://www.protest-the-pope.org.uk/

We hope you will be able to participate in some of the events we have lined up, particularly the march through central London on Saturday 18 September. This will be happening while the Pope is preaching in Hyde Park and will be a reminder that not everyone thinks he is a hero. We need a good turnout for this march, so please do your best to be there and spread the word in any way you can. Details of the starting point and times can be found at the Protest the Pope website.

Other dates for your diary include the film season, a party and a debate – all details at Protest the Pope website.


Join Us

The National Secular Society is the UK's leading campaigning organisation defending our society from the demands of those who seek religious privilege. If you are not already a member, please consider joining us and making a vital contribution to our important work. Together, we can make a difference. www.secularism.org.uk

[Gottard]

I wonder if any of you knows how came that the Vatican took home in Rome. This is history taught to teenagers in Italy.
Constantine the 1st, last Roman emperor, fell sick and he was cured in a convent by priest doctors; then he died and the then pope (can't remember his name now) showed a testament where 'Constantine left what was left of the Roman empire to the Roman Catholic church'.
It was around the year400 (Middle Eve), when the Country was composed of several little states and Duchies.
In the year 450 CE, a learned monk, Lorenzo Valla, demonstrated that the aforesaid testament was a forgery on account of some written words that Constantine could have not known. Mr. Valla had to accept hospitality and protection of the king of Naples (the Aragona dinasty) as the Vatican had condemned the monk to death for heresy. Further studies led in later centuries witnessed that Valla was right!
Now I ask myself (before you do): How is it the the Vatican still exerts a terrestrial right/rule?

[Marian]

Now I ask myself (before you do): How is it the the Vatican still exerts a terrestrial right/rule?

Money and power.

[Alan H]

Money and power.

Since the two are, effectively, the same thing, that's just one reason.

[Alan H]

The latest news:

Pope and Blair to combine state visits

[jaywhat]

[Fia]

My eldest, at uni in Edinburgh, has been told that all classes are cancelled for his popeiness's visit next month. She's incensed, and has been looking for a group to protest with on the day. Neither of us can find anything, so does anyone know of any protest the pope gatherings in Edinburgh? Neither the ptp or NSS websites nor ixquick could help...

[Alan H]

From the Scottish Catholic media Office this afternoon:

********************************************************************************
POLL SHOWS OPPOSITION TO THE PAPAL VISIT EVAPORATING
http://scmo.org/articles/poll-shows-opp ... ating.html
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

POLL SHOWS OPPOSITION TO THE PAPAL VISIT EVAPORATING

* Written By: SCMO
* 29-08-2010
* Categorized in: News Releases

Sunday 29 August 2010

POLL SHOWS OPPOSITION TO THE PAPAL VISIT EVAPORATING

Opposition to next month’s Papal Visit to Scotland seems to be dramatically
smaller than predicted, according to a new poll out today. The survey
suggests that a few as 2% of Scots say they’re “strongly opposed” to the
visit with over fifteen times as many people saying they’re in favour of it.

The survey, carried out by Opinion Research Business and surveying over
1000 adults across Scotland, finds that only 2% of Scots say they “strongly
object” to the visit whilst another 3% say they “object”.

Commenting on the findings, Cardinal Keith Patrick O’Brien said;
“I am greatly heartened by the results of this poll as it again confirms
that the vast majority of Scots are warm hearted and welcoming of all
people. Next month’s Papal Visit is going to be a truly historic occasion
for our country and one which I hope all Scots will share in and enjoy.”

The visit of Benedict XVI will be the first ever state visit by a Pope to
the UK. It begins on 16 September, the Feast Day of St Ninian, when the Holy
Father will arrive in Edinburgh where he will be welcomed by the Queen at
the Palace of Holyroodhouse before going on to greet crowds in the
Popemobile along Princes Street. Later in the afternoon, he will travel onto
Glasgow where he will offer Mass before a crowd of 100,000 at Bellahouston
Park. There the Scottish singing sensation Susan Boyle will fulfil her
“lifetime ambition” of performing for the Holy Father. It’s estimated that
the worldwide television audience for the Papal Visit to Scotland could top
one billion.

Today’s poll also shows that 70% of Scots consider themselves Christian, up
on the last census of 2001, and that nearly half of all Scots said they go
to church at least once a month.

It also emerged today the London-based secularist campaign group “Protest
the Pope” have ditched plans to hold protests against the Pope in Scotland.
Instead the group will now hold only one march in London. Commenting on
these developments, spokesman for the Catholic Church in Scotland Peter
Kearney said;

“It’s now clear to everybody that this tiny minority of secularists speak
for nobody but themselves. Most Scots will be delighted to hear that they’ve
given up their attempt to spoil what promises to be a very exciting day for
all Scots.”
ENDS

Peter Kearney
Director
Catholic Media Office
5 St. Vincent Place
Glasgow
G1 2DH
0141 221 1168
07968 122291
[email protected]
www.scmo.org

Notes for Editors;
1. The poll was carried out by Opinion Research Business and interviewed
a nationally representative survey of 1,007 adults aged 18+ in Scotland
between 7-9 June, 2010. The poll was commissioned by the Scottish Catholic
Media Office. Where figures do not add up to 100% this may be due to
rounding, where respondents could give more than one answer or where some
respondents answered “Don’t know” or “refused”. For more information of ORB
contact http://www.opinion.co.uk/index.aspx



2. Question: As you may know, the Pope is due to visit Scotland in
September of this year. How much do you favour or object to the visit?



Very or fairly favourable 31%

Neither for nor against 63%

Object 3%

Strongly object 2%

Don’t know 1%

Refused *



3. Question: Irrespective of whether you go to church, do you regard
yourself as a Christian?



Yes, I regard myself as a Christian 70%

I do not regard myself as a Christian 26%

I am a member of a non-Christian religion,
so I do not regard myself as a Christian 2%

Don’t know 2%

Refused *







4. Question: Apart from weddings, funerals and christenings, about how
often do you attend religious services these days?



Once a week or more 20%

Once a month or more 26%

Less often 28%

Never 33%

Don’t know *

Refused *


5. For previous threats by Protest the Pope;

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/u ... 064660.ece


6. Revised website of Protest the Pope now containing no plans for
Scottish protests;

http://www.protest-the-pope.org.uk/

[Retrieved: Sun Aug 29 2010 20:00:15 GMT+0100 (BST)]

###################

[Fia]

Many thanks for that Alan. I've emailed a "why" to the ptp group.

And when will they learn that just as many folk under report what they drink, xtians have a clear tendency to over report their church attendance...

[Fia]

I've had a reply:

Thank you for your request for more information. PROTEST THE POPE has been overwhelmed by requests for a demonstration in Scotland to protest at Herr Ratzinger’s ‘State’ visit.

I’m doing my best to help organise something for Protest the Pope and the National Secular Society on 16 September. If you receive the free NSS e-newsletter you may already be aware that while Westminster wants our Strathclyde and Lothian and Borders police to fund it, State visits are reserved matters and there is a big question mark over where the money’s coming from. This might explain the Chief Constable of Strathclyde Police, Steve House’s remarks when he said a couple of weeks ago to a meeting of his own Authority, “The extra cost the papal visit presents us with will be met by someone else. I'm not saying who. I don't care!”

I have spoken with the Public Events Division for Glasgow's Strathclyde Police last week and am still waiting for them to get back to me to tell me exactly where they suggest people who want to protest can gather. I will keep you posted about this or any other groups plans.

Personally, if I could make it to Edinburgh I would demonstrate outside the The Scotsman’s office for their part in being a mouthpiece for the misinformation that has been coming out of the Scottish Catholic Media Office and censoring the opinions of those opposed to the visit. (Through their press cronies, the SCMO have been positively gloating that no protests have been organised). Then I’d like to join the human shield of young children who will be lining the route of the St Ninian’s Day parade along Regent Road, Waterloo Place and Princes Street. What the police need to inform us is exactly where we can catch the Popemobile and blow vuvuzelas as it heads to and from Holyrood, at about 10:30, after the Pope's arrival at Edinburgh Airport, and again at 12:30 before he visits the Cardinal at his home in Morningside.

I have suggested to police that we start outside STV from 15:00 to protest against Hour presenter, Michelle McManus joining Susan Boyle in aiding and abetting this organisation that remains unanswerable to international law. (15:00 is when supporters of the Pope have been asked to be at Bellahouston Park). STV is almost next door to BBC Scotland on Ocean Quay. The BBC receives £10m annually for religious proselytising and has sent a representative out to the Vatican to explain how the organisation will promote the visit. BBC Radio 4’s Mark Damazar has been prevented from interrupting the news with a ‘Thought for the Day’ from Herr Ratzinger. Along with BBC Scotland’s input, the BBC will be shifting popular programmes to provide a staggering 12 hours plus of papal adulation! Many heads of organisations like the Equality Network and the Humanist Society of Scotland are hoping to respond to any papal announcements from Bellahouston Park so will want to be there should the BBC give them an opportunity to speak. I would think it unlikely any protesters will be able to get anywhere near Bellahouston Park although the BBC at Bell’s Bridge, Ocean Quay is only a 30 minute walk from Bellahouston Park. The Pope is expected to arrive at Bellahouston Park at 17:15 and the event finishes 19:30 with the Pope leaving Glasgow airport at 20:00.

Kind Regards

Garry Otton

For Protest the Pope

http://www.scottishmediamonitor.com/features2.cfm?ID=43

[grammar king]

My eldest, at uni in Edinburgh, has been told that all classes are cancelled for his popeiness's visit next month. She's incensed, and has been looking for a group to protest with on the day. Neither of us can find anything, so does anyone know of any protest the pope gatherings in Edinburgh? Neither the ptp or NSS websites nor ixquick could help...

YES! There were witterings of a protest at Bellahouston Park but a friend and I had a look and it's terribly organised, so this morning we decided to stage one in Edinburgh. We haven't finalised the details but I suspect we'll be rallying outside the National Galleries at The Mound and Princes Street with some placards, hand out some flyers and maybe some condoms if we can get them. Yes, short notice but I'll be working hard to see if I can get something done. Spread the word!

Edit: Here's the facebook group. I'll set up an event as soon as we decide something, and assuming the police don't rain on our parade.

[Fia]

Many thanks GK, I've sent my daughter the facebook page link. Doesn't the student union have loadsa condoms to give out at freshers week?

Do you really think the polis will be ok with an ad hoc demo? I could do without having to come all the way down to Edinburgh to bail her out

[grammar king]

I called the police today, they told me to call the council, then they told me to call the police, etc etc. In the end I got through to the police guy in charge of the event and he's going to come and visit me at work tomorrow to discuss it. After that I'll make a facebook event and get publicising. Looks like it's going to be outside Usher Hall on Lothian Road, based on various phone conversations I had today.

Bear in mind that facebook group is just a little discussion group, to which I invited people who might be interested in organising or publicising. When I make an event I'll post it here.

[Nick]

Best of luck, GK

Next Monday, Channel 4 8pm Peter Tatchell on the Pope's visit.

[Alan H]

GK, I'm sure the Protest the Pope could send you a few posters or something to help you - If you'd like to ask them, let me know and I'll send you a contact email address.

[Gottard]

Best of luck, GK
Next Monday, Channel 4 8pm Peter Tatchell on the Pope's visit.

No access to Ch.4 or BBC from outside the UK ...we are into a united Europe, nonetheless!
P.S.: you as well as we pay a TV compulsory tax.

[grammar king]

Cheers all.

Here's the Facebook event. The police have given us an area and put me in charge of it :s. Hopefully nothing'll go wrong or one of you'll have to come and bail me out. The area's not huge so I'm not so worried about numbers just now, but these kinds of contacts are always useful to have, so if you could give me that email address Alan, that'd be marvellous.

[grammar king]

Best of luck, GK
Next Monday, Channel 4 8pm Peter Tatchell on the Pope's visit.

No access to Ch.4 or BBC from outside the UK ...we are into a united Europe, nonetheless!
P.S.: you as well as we pay a TV compulsory tax.

I believe Channel 4 can be viewed on 4OD outside the UK, although I've never tried it personally. If not, you might want to experiment with a UK proxy server. I've never got it working but maybe you'll have better luck.

[Alan H]

Cheers all.

Here's the Facebook event. The police have given us an area and put me in charge of it :s. Hopefully nothing'll go wrong or one of you'll have to come and bail me out. The area's not huge so I'm not so worried about numbers just now, but these kinds of contacts are always useful to have, so if you could give me that email address Alan, that'd be marvellous.

Done - see my PM. I hope Marco is able to help.

[Vicky]

Morning, all!

Wish I were nearer to be able to join a P the P demo.........(the best I could do was to sign the petition).

Thought you might like to see what the Isle of Man Post Office has done to celebrate:-

http://www.isleofman.com/News/article.a ... 754&area=2

Hope I've managed to get the link OK.

Vicky

[Nick]

You managed the link just fine, Vicky.

I posted this in the comments section:

I hope that all profits from this special issue will be donated to victims of Roman Catholic abuse of children throughout the world.

I wonder is the moderators will allow it....