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Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

For discussions related to education and educational institutions.
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Alan H
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Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#1 Post by Alan H » November 26th, 2011, 11:05 am

Michael Gove to send copy of King James Bible to all English schools
Every state school in England is to receive a new copy of the King James Bible from the government – with a brief foreword by Michael Gove, the education secretary, to mark the 400th anniversary of its translation. In a move intended to help every pupil access Britain's cultural heritage, every primary and secondary school will be sent a new copy of the 1611 translation by next Easter.
Words fail me other than to say, what an utterly stupid, pompous, Tory prick.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Fia
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#2 Post by Fia » November 26th, 2011, 11:12 am

what an utterly stupid, pompous, Tory prick.
Hear hear :) I wonder what other religious faith schools make of this? Hardly equitable is it? Cue others demanding the state pay for their 'holy' book in every school... should we demand 'Origin of Species'?

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Dave B
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#3 Post by Dave B » November 26th, 2011, 11:27 am

Whilst I accept that the KJB is a superb piece of English writing, along with Shakespeare, "The Origin . . ." and some others, I have to be sceptical about the motives here.

And, as Fia says, it is hardly a good example of British values of equality, seems more like a superb example of biased Tory ideology.

Not quite on the same line, but still indicative of Tory twaddle, have you heard of the little TV greeting to hospital patients by Andrew Lansley? Sounds enough to send medical patients to the psychiatric ward! They had these one-per-bed-pay-TVs in the John Radcliffe in Oxford. The only way to stop them flashing away (you could silence them) was to pull the plug out of the wall. We were not supposed to but it happened so often the staff ignored it.
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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Tetenterre
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#4 Post by Tetenterre » November 26th, 2011, 11:50 am

What a plonker! Far better to provide them with a copy of "The Origin..." and pass a law that every teacher must read and understand it within a year as part of CPD; new teachers to do so before getting QTS.
Steve

Quantum Theory: The branch of science with which people who know absolutely sod all about quantum theory can explain anything.

Nick
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#5 Post by Nick » November 26th, 2011, 1:02 pm

As if they won't already have a copy.... :sad2:

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Alan H
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#6 Post by Alan H » November 26th, 2011, 2:18 pm

Quite. And we hear stories of schools struggling to buy proper text books.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

keithprosser2
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#7 Post by keithprosser2 » November 26th, 2011, 3:42 pm

As an atheist who adores the grandeur of the KJV I have somewhat mixed feelings! I think it is not a bad to mark the 400th anniversary of a such great work of literature in some way, but it is an awkward precedent. These are religiously sensitive - one might say - paranoid days. This is bound to cause more controversy that, say, issuing copies of Shakespeare's sonnets because while the KJV is literature, its not only literature. The scripture of a religion has tremendous symbolic baggage.

If this happened in the US, I would expect that the motivation was indeed evangelical zeal, but I don't think that is so here. Gove I think is a primarily a traditionalist, not a Christian proselytiser and it as a potent symbol of tradition Gove took this step - I think, or hope. I think he was mistaken, not in celebrating the anniversary of a great piece of British literature (I wish that was a regular thing) but in seriously underestimating the sensitivity of choosing this particular example. I'm surprised his "Sir Humphrey" didn't point that out sufficiently robustly.

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Alan H
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#8 Post by Alan H » November 26th, 2011, 4:12 pm

He is, of course, a believer:
Having been raised in the Church of Scotland, he now worships in the Church of England, and regularly attends St Mary Abbots[35] church, Kensington, London.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Nick
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#9 Post by Nick » November 26th, 2011, 4:47 pm

I am very much inclined to agree with keithprosser, about tradition over evangelism. When I manned the BHA stand at the Tory Conference, there was a clear range of views, from the fiercely atheist (more common than you might think) to the strongly religious (who generally adopted an offended or wounded attitude). The largest group, by some way, were those who just rolled along with the presence of religion in schools. Either they hadn't given it much thought (I can't understand that!) or they thought it was sueful in developing an "ethos" which was good for schools and society and the people in it.

They were genuinely very keen that everyone should have a chance, and if that meant using religion, then no harm done, eh? On several occasions, the response was (I papaphrase) "well, of course there's no God, but I can't really say that because I'm a governor of a C of E school". On other occasions, they felt there were bigger fish to fry (the NUT, for example) than to worry about something as innocuous as the C of E.

So, though we must maintain our opposition to religion in schools, I think it is as important that we demonstrate how a humanist, secular approach to education can produce good citizens and good schools. The ever-increasing levels of atheism in the younger generations should give us an increasing advantage. We must be able to demonstrate that schools do not need God to be good.

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Ken H
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#10 Post by Ken H » November 26th, 2011, 4:57 pm

I wonder if that would include the Muslim schools?

Always room for more works of fiction in the school's library...
This is one of the great social functions of science - to free people of superstition. - Steven Weinberg

Fia
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#11 Post by Fia » November 26th, 2011, 6:18 pm

I consider it a duty when I'm in a library to move it from the 100s to a random fiction shelf :)

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Alan C.
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#12 Post by Alan C. » November 26th, 2011, 8:09 pm

Post Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England
I despair, I really do.
fia
I consider it a duty when I'm in a library to move it from the 100s to a random fiction shelf
I've never seen a bible in our library and we visit every week. (There is a Koran)
However; there is a suggestion box in which I've said they should remove all the pseudo "science" stuff and re-locate it to fiction, as of now they haven't :cross:
I'll keep at them and see who tires first. :)

Edit.
For those who may not know our library is an ex Church, complete with stained glass windows and suchlike.
Abstinence Makes the Church Grow Fondlers.

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Alan H
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#13 Post by Alan H » November 26th, 2011, 8:17 pm

Library? Here's a photo of our library.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Fia
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#14 Post by Fia » November 26th, 2011, 10:02 pm

That, Alan H, is so sad. A community greatly lessened. From your link:
you should be ashamed to deprive children of books
Quite. At the rate my 2 went through them when they were wee (8 a week, each) who can afford to buy that many even in charity shops? I bought their favourites: Dr Suess, 'The Queen's knickers', 'tick tock', some Shirley Hughes. I predict more children starting school who don't know how to open a book :boohoo: No encouragement to get them into libraries (although, as many good things this is Scotland only, the English version doesn't have the library connection.)

Alan C: I love your library! Particularly the sofas upstairs where scary looking teenagers hang out. When I was there one of them stood up, said how nice it was to meet me again and introduced me to his cohorts :D

In the beginning there was the Dewey decimal system, and before you get to the 200s is where the gods usually nestle... unless I've been there, right enough I checked at yours but no bible. Sadly the system doesn't have a woo section but I have been known to make a display of the worst culprits juxtaposed with some Dawkins, Grayling, Hitchins, Baggini etc :laughter: Makes for great conversation in our small, loud and busy library.

Apologies for :offtopic: ness. But libraries, not schools, were where I learnt. A habit still with me - I collected Noam Chomsky's 'Hopes and Prospects' today :clap:
It is appalling that Alan H's community doesn't have this precious resource.

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Alan H
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#15 Post by Alan H » November 26th, 2011, 11:28 pm

Fia wrote:In the beginning there was the Dewey decimal system...
My favourite as a teenager was 621.3841 (I kid you not!)
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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Alan H
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#16 Post by Alan H » November 26th, 2011, 11:29 pm

I believe one of our Councillors was heard to say that it was OK, kids could buy cheap books in Tescos.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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bindeweede
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#17 Post by bindeweede » November 26th, 2011, 11:49 pm

I wondered if people have seen this. A bit feeble, but.......

http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/1273253 ... s-biblical

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Dave B
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#18 Post by Dave B » November 27th, 2011, 9:45 am

My favourite as a teenager was 621.3841 (I kid you not!)
The amateur radio manual?

"Modern Crystal Sets"?
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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jaywhat
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#19 Post by jaywhat » November 27th, 2011, 10:13 am

Lansley showing his smiley face and getting himself all over the NHS and now Gove with his name in a bible in every school. 'Look mummy - what I have achieved' . All of them self opinionated pompous bastards.

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Alan H
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Re: Gove wants to send a bible to every school in England

#20 Post by Alan H » November 27th, 2011, 10:38 am

Dave B wrote:
My favourite as a teenager was 621.3841 (I kid you not!)
The amateur radio manual?

"Modern Crystal Sets"?
:smile: Built many crystal radios, progressing on to super-regen and double superhet ones.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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