Crop Circles

[getreal]

Latest post of the previous page:

[Marié]

OK,

Complexity co-inciding with the development of computers: Yes. Maybe computers do have something to do with it, like for planning them, laying them out, or something that has yet to be understood. Remote Human creation, no scientific evidence. Yeah, that's what makes it intruiging to me. I wanna know how it happens. I've (merely) heard they lay flat in a matter of seconds. Perhaps too much sci-fi in my life though, I admit. I grew up on Star Trek.

Dimentional space representations: ones with pyramids within hexagons within cubes, that look concave or convex depending how you look at them, illusions yes. And others I can't remember but looked really weird, sorry, I'm being indistinct again.

Why I think there's something strange afoot: because from the information I have had, there is no adequate explanation, and a mystery, to me like unto many other humans, is irresistable.

But like you say, perhaps I have let my imagination run away with me in my eagerness to find "More" in the world. Or maybe it's just an interest of mine, that you don't share, and don't have to. I thank you for participating in the discussion and the research! But I will likely still read up on, watch movies and documentaries about, and listen to stories about: telekinesis, esp, ghosts, pyrokinesis and other stuff though, even if just for fun. : )

Please do read up on and watch documentaries on any topic you are interested in, but I would encourage you to be extremely sceptical, too, especially when it comes to "paranormal" or "supernatural" phenomena. There are an awful lot of unreliable books, documentaries and research papers. Sometimes it is a result of deliberately ignoring some evidence or not exploring all possibilities, other times it is just bad research or just being blind to one's own presuppositions; often people, sometimes even respectable scientists, have a specific ideology or a set of values and ideas, and they want to find evidence to support that ideology. It is easy to take something that seems well-researched, with an extensive bibliography and academic appearance, as fact, especially when it is written by someone with a PhD or an "expert". We should still keep in mind that they are still human beings with values and ideologies and that science or research of any kind do not exist in a vacuum outside society and its influence.

[getreal]

"throughout history
every mystery
ever solved
has proved to be
not magic"


Att. T. Minchin

[Hundovir]

Oh! What a shame!

[Elanor]

Thanks Marie, for your reply. I totaly agree. I seem to have won myself some enemies here. I can't seem to pull myself out of this poor image!

Believe it or not, I do love the world and the universe for the interesting and fantastic thing that it is. Magic is just a word for things we don't yet understand. "Yes, I guess this would seem like magic to you."- the Traveler, Star Trek, NG. There are many things we have yet to study and catalogue and learn.

Odd how here I am the namby pamby wishy washy one, and elsewhere I am the staunch non-believer and offender of christians. Interesting.

[Hundovir]

I seem to have won myself some enemies here.

Well, I'm not one of them. Although I'll argue the hind leg off a donkey if I think someone is mistaken and is up for an argument! I assume you are up for continued arguments?

Odd how here I am the namby pamby wishy washy one, and elsewhere I am the staunch non-believer and offender of christians. Interesting.

That must feel rather confusing!

[Lifelinking]

I seem to have won myself some enemies here

How awful that you feel anybody here thinks of you as an enemy Elanor, and I am glad Hundovir jumped in already to show otherwise.

We (and I mean everybody here at TH) disagree about an awful lot of stuff. But because we disagree, or pull arguments apart, or ask for evidence for stuff, does not mean we see other people involved as enemies. We can even have quite a good laugh while we are disagreeing.

Most of the folk here are sceptics, and do not easily buy in to things without a lot of critical thought. But while we can be scathing about some ideas, I hope we remain decent and friendly to individuals. I suppose if one's ideas are currently 'in the crosshairs', it might be difficult to appreciate the difference, but it is there. I do hope that you find your experience here a positive one Elanor, and find that we can all disagree here, without being enemies.

After all it is in that mix of having our ideas challenged and other ones placed before us, that we humans learn.

[Alan H]

I agree entirely! You have no enemies here, Elanor, just folks who have come to different conclusions to you. We are certainly sceptical about crop circles, simply because they could so easily be man-made and we're not seen any evidence that would convince us otherwise.

I do hope we can continue this discussion [---][/---] but please don't feel harangued!

[jaywhat]

Earlier I muttered about the loss to farmers and since then I realise that 'crop-circling' really annoys me - for that reason.
One is led to wonder why the only crop circles seem to be in grown crops and not in ordinary grassy fields or on moorlands. You could argue that they are in those places but we do not see them so easily. Surely 'mumbo jumbo' circles would be on glaciers and hillsides and in tropical jungles. Perhaps they are.

[getreal]

Please don't feel you have any enemies here, Elinor. This whole site is (I think) about arguing, in a logical, consistant manner, your point.

It has really helped me to reappraise my views on some things (I lurk. A LOT!!)

I can confirm that not all sites are like that and some can be quite hurtful (though I think I must be a bit of a cissy to have hurt feelings over some comments made by people I have never, and will never meet!)

[Elanor]

Thank you guys. I appreciate all your comments, makes me feel better. I don't want to argue about crop circles any more. Just one note though, they have been found in trees, ice and wild prairie.

I concur, it isn't right for people to go onto private property and damage valuable crops. I heard about a farmer shooting at circlemakers, that's worse! Maybe just large no trespassing signs would be enough? I certainly hope no-one gets hurt.

The reaction here has been very different than I'm used to on the church forum that's for sure. I have learned stuff allready. I've learned stuff there too of cource. This has been enlightening. Now I know better how they feel when I critisize their views.

I was once shocked to discover that my born again aunt felt hurt by the facts when I neatly placed them before her, in what I thought was a polite manner in an email. My mom told me she asked her what she'd done to make me mad at her. I didn't realize that holding on to her beliefs was so difficult for her. Then I felt really sorry for her. I thought she really believed that tripe. Turns out she's not a born again now since her husband died. ANYWAY, that's a different topic!

Thanks again guys..

[Marié]

Eleanor, I agree with others' comments here on that you have no enemies here. And I certainly hope I, or anyone else here, did not make you feel like I don't like you as a person. Although I just joined quite recently myself, it seems that most people here (including you) like to hear opposing points of views. I know I do, especially from people who are capable of actually discussing their views and are willing to accept the possibility that they are wrong or may have to alter their point of view in some way. And you certainly seem like that kind of a person!

[Alan H]

For some reason, Google.co.uk has a crop circle theme today:

[jaywhat]

so that's what it is

[Alan H]

Ah! It's the birthday of H G Wells: http://www.astroengine.com/?p=6457

I still find it strange they chose a crop circle. Why not a time machine? I'm not convinced HG Wells is the right explanation...

[Alan H]

I had no idea there were so many of these!

[Marié]

I had no idea there were so many of these!

Maybe they need more pubs in Wiltshire. Or on second thought, maybe they need less pubs and more libraries or gyms or...?