VINDICATOR wrote:Dear animist,
Thanks for your interest. The Muslim slave owners in Africa didn't take their African slaves back to Arabia, they were doing the dirty business of coralling Black slaves in Africa and selling them directly to the American slave traders there. It was a division of labor. Look it up in historical literature. Muslims didn't need Black slaves, they had enough indigenous slaves. Even today you will find slave trade in Muslim countries.
my previous post referred to East Africa, whereas the Atlantic slave trade obviously centred on West Africa. Arab Muslims may well have been involved in the latter in the way you mention, but the point about exclusively Arab slavers in East Africa was what the film-maker was referring to, IIRC
VINDICATOR wrote:Muslim women are a special case of slavery. This includes FGM, selling girls for wives, etc. We will look into these problems in detail.
1-FGM: A Muslim man doesn't want a wife, he wants a sex-slave, breeding machine, and household servant. In order to ensure her fidelity, she will be subjected to FGM, ie. Female Genital Mutilation. They take the young girls and cut out their clitoris and other erogenous zones leaving only scar tissue so that she has no pleasure in sex, only pain.Then the man is confident that she won't have any extramarital sex! She doesn't even want to have sex with her "husband" so he hangs a whip by the bed to let her know what will happen if she denies him!
FGM is not a Muslim doctrine and has been practised in Xian societies like Ethiopia and (I assume) largely animist parts of Africa (oops - my forum name is embarrassing me now!)
VINDICATOR wrote:2-Honor murder: Young girls are sold to old men, and are otherwise coerced into sex against their will. They are not allowed to marry the boy they want to. If she resists, she will be murdered by her family. This is called "honor killing"! Although this and FGM not mandated by the Koran, it is very rampant in Islamic countries. At least 9000 girls are honor murdered every year in Pakistan alone!
again, you are pretty correct to point to this, but I think that arranged and maybe even forced, marriages, honour killings and the rest are part of other than Muslim societies - eg Hindu and other religious traditions. I would guess that most marriages in history have been more or less arranged, with modern notions of choice and romance rather absent. Young men as well as young women would not have had the freedom to choose that we take for granted today, though of course you're right to say that women are especially unfree in most societies
VINDICATOR wrote:3-Shariah Law: According to Shariah Law, a woman has to have 4 male witnesses willing to testify to her innocence, otherwise she is guilty! That's why you never hear of rape in a Shariah country, it's never reported! In a Shariah country, a rape victim is guilty of fornication, and is liable to be stoned to death! In 2013 a norwegian girl Marte Debora Dalel was sentenced to 18 months in prison for being raped in Dubai. This is very lenient because she was an expat!
I think that rapes are reported in Muslim societies, but of course you are right about the problems which a female victim of rape faces
VINDICATOR wrote:4-etc. There are plenty more examples, such as not allowing unaccompanied women outdoors, not letting women drive cars, forcing women to wear a tent, etc. etc. I don't think that the Black slaves in America were any more miserable than the Shariah women!
I doubt your last statement. Again, I agree with the general drift of what you say, Vinnie, but maybe you should not single out Islam as particularly guilty on these various counts. I do get the impression that women have till modern times been very much second-class members of most societies and have had substantially less control over their lives than men of the same social rank. If you want to call this slavery, I might not disagree, though it may be a bit simplistic to lump everything together in the way that you do